July 2020 - Ucol-shareholders

apology for meeting tonight
by Roz Wilson 23 Jul '20

23 Jul '20

The village has a cold, we have a cold. So can someone please put in an apology for us? We are still planning to come to the bc meeting on Sunday, and have done our homework! Regds roz

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Re: [Ucol-shareholders] Tight Version of Toiora HS Body Corp Rules for Workshop on 26 July 2020
by Min 22 Jul '20

22 Jul '20

Hello all This is the version of the Body Corp rules we will be going through at the Workshop coming up. I believe the workshop will be held at Numberworks, so we can take advantage of the overhead screen. *2-5pm Sunday 26 July * *at NumberWorks’nWords,90 Crawford Street * * * I have also included a Draft Outline of what our Cohousing Agreement will look like. When complete, both documents are meant to be read together. Regards Min

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Approval for above budget expenditure to fix PassiveHaus compliance issues
by Alex King 20 Jul '20

20 Jul '20

Hi, Please email me back with approval to spend an extra $26,000 on the build. (Or not) The directors have been asked to approve a payment for some extra work involved in achieving passivehaus compliance that was not detailed on the plans. The main issue (with details and extra taping required around the inter-tenancy walls) has been costed at just over $26,000 to rectify, and the contractors have already done the majority of the work, including some extra labour they did not charge us for. We are getting low on contingency. (approximately $100,000) We can afford to pay the $26,000 now, but if other things come up that are essential to do in future it makes it more likely we will need to find further funds, beyond the price for the units you have signed up for. I would appreciate people's approval for us to pay the extra $1000 per unit for work that was mostly completed already. Technically the directors require approval of shareholders to spend amounts more than $20,000 over budget. The directors have only just become aware of this situation because the contractors were not strictly following the process for variations. It has already been raised with the contractors, and directors will insist that future variations are done correctly, so we get to approve this type of work before it is done. If anyone responds that they don't want to approve this yet, we will delay paying that part of the contractor's invoice, and we will discuss it at our next meeting. They are doing a great job overall other than this issue. Thanks, Alex

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Re: [Ucol-shareholders] Update on the Body Corp Rules
by Min 19 Jul '20

19 Jul '20

Hello everyone, At our last group meeting, there was some intense discussion about my recent proposal for the process to change body corp rules. Specifically, whether we decide to change Body Corp Rules by consensus only, or if there should also be a voting option. This has turned out to be a part of our Rules that ends up being quite contentious, and difficult to reach consensus on. It is by no means the only part. However, what has come out of the brainstorming for the procedure to change BC rules, is the idea of wearing "two hats" as Donald put it. Warren was then inspired to write up his 'Tight vs Loose Cultures" document explaining our experience of having sections of the BC Rules where we will discuss a sticking point for hours, unable to reach consensus. Would everyone please read the "Tight vs Loose Cultures" document by Warren. I have also attached as statement from me about how I plan to move forwards with the Body Corp rules. I will be working on the updated document this weekend, and the upcoming workshop will be a test of this new tight vs loose paradigm. A copy of the Rules will be sent out to all members before the workshop. Warren and I will be available at the next Thursday group meeting to clarify any items and answer questions. Regards Min

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with thanks to Warren, Min & Janare you esp
by mariannequinn＠xtra.co.nz 18 Jul '20

18 Jul '20

Hi team - especially Warren, Min, and Jan- thank you each for your thoughtful contributions. Another example of the many skills that are held within this group, and how useful are different experiences and approaches can be in designing a positive outcome. Thanks to Min and Warren for helping untangle the body corporate process; I look forward to discussing this further later in the week, by which time I will have re-red your suggestions in more depth. Thanks again to Jan for her "regularly irregular" newsletters, especially in launching our new name ( Toiora high Street cohousing) to interested parties, and documenting our latest- - but not last- brick moving party!! It's great working with you all. Best wishes meantime Marianne Marianne Quinn Level 3, 115 Stuart Street, Dunedin P.O. Box 20, Dunedin 9054 ph +6434773115 or 0211612050

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Draft agenda 23 July 2020
by Sander Zwanenburg 16 Jul '20

16 Jul '20

Hi all Here's a draft of next meeting's agenda. Anything to add? Let me know. Thanks Sander Thursday 23 July at 7.30pm at the Centre for Sustainability staffroom and via Zoom Meeting ID: 9016 25 9016 Password 25 25 25 https://otago.zoom.us/j/9016259016?pwd=ZGZQRnM2L2tsai90eENKRExQUEtJQT09 Apologies: Dennis Chan & Adelyn, Susan Jack, Rosemarie and Maurice, Appreciations Body Corp/Cohousing community decisions (Min/Warren; see docs sent out) Organisation for Body Corp Workshop 26 July (Min) BCG PCG Report from last working bee Pot Luck dinner 26 July (Anne) Update to do list (Donald) Link to view UCOL ToDo list https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1H0NKzfH9NQXamP-Hx6HyrS0hvkhZ_TFpfl6… Open Forum

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Final notes from the meeting 9 July attached
by Jan Burch 16 Jul '20

16 Jul '20

Kia ora koutou This is as good as it gets. My best attempt at the notes from the last meeting. Ka kite koutou Jan

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Draft notes for 9 July attached
by Jan Burch 13 Jul '20

13 Jul '20

Gidday fellow Toiora-ites I've taken the precaution of creating a second draft of the notes from 9 July because I'm not 100% sure that the adjustments that I've made will be satisfactory for all concerned and I believe it is important that everyone is happy with the records we keep. As usual with a draft copy, please check, and if you do not think I have correctly interpreted what was said/done at the meeting, *send me the correction *for the appropriate bit. I'll amend and send out the final copy on Thursday. Thanks for your help with this task Jan

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Re: [Ucol-shareholders] Process to change body corp rules
by Catherine Spencer 10 Jul '20

10 Jul '20

The version of the BC Rules attached to our S&P agreements, drafted by our lawyer using both the Earthsong and regular BC rules song with our own input at the time is perfectly legal. That used the Group Decision Making Process for decision making and it met the Unit Titles Act. It was also perused and accepted by the DCC lawyers. It also included: e) The Body Corporate may from time to time and by a majority resolution amend these rules or make additional rules, regulations and bylaws for the use and enjoyment of common property or any part thereof. The quorum in a meeting to amend the Rules shall comprise Shareholders present or by proxy who comprise 75% of those Shareholders entitled to vote. I would be in favour of adding after by a majority resolution "through the group decision making process" (Schedule 2) Shareholders will also need to be amended. Maybe: The quorum in a meeting to amend the Rules shall comprise those present or by proxy who comprise 75% of the Group entitled to show cards. (There is a set of definitions at the beginning of the document.) I don’t think we need to ask the questions below. It would be prudent in my opinion to finalise the document within the group and then pass it by the lawyer. Catherine > On 10/07/2020, at 9:07 PM, Min <yblees(a)orcon.net.nz <mailto:yblees@orcon.net.nz>> wrote: > > I've just read through Earthsong's Body Corp Rules posted on their website, and I think we do need the legal team to clarify two points before moving further with this specific procedure. > > 1. Can we pass resolutions(eg. change bc rules) by "consensus" only, considering the voting process is specified in the Unit Titles Act sections 97, 98 & 101 > 2. Can the Body Corp, as made up by unit owners, pass a resolution allowing/inviting tenants to take part in the decision making process discussion to change body corp rules, even if the tenants / non-owners do not take part in the actual "vote" to change the resolution. > > Could the legal liaison committee please get in touch with me, or would the directors be better placed to handle this? > > Regards > > Min > > On 10/07/20 10:34 am, Gay Buckingham wrote: >> Could we please ask our legal team to clarify this. >> Gay >> Gay Buckingham >> +64 27 4544012 >> >> >> >>> On 10/07/2020, at 10:32 AM, bluefrog <bluefrog(a)orcon.net.nz <mailto:bluefrog@orcon.net.nz>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi Roz, I'll set aside some time to discuss this at the workshop. >>> However, while all owners legally have a right to participate in the Body Corp, I don't think there is a law that excludes the option of inviting non owners into the body Corp meetings, so long as the owners agree. >>> >>> It becomes a matter of how inclusive the co-housing community wants to be, as opposed to a standard, ordinary unit title development. In fact making decision by consensus only is already not the normal process for passing bc resolutions. >>> >>> We can also waive or change the need for a body Corp committee if the owners agree. We could end up with many small commitees like co-housing groups Jan saw in America, rather than one administrating committee that is the norm. >>> >>> Min >>> >>> -------- Original message -------- >>> From: Roz Wilson <michael.rosemary(a)xtra.co.nz <mailto:michael.rosemary@xtra.co.nz>> >>> Date: 10/07/2020 8:53 am (GMT+12:00) >>> To: alex king <alex(a)king.net.nz <mailto:alex@king.net.nz>>, Anne Thomson <e.anne.thomson(a)gmail.com <mailto:e.anne.thomson@gmail.com>>, Catherine Spencer <cmspencer.nz(a)zoho.com <mailto:cmspencer.nz@zoho.com>>, Claire Loftus <passionforlanguage(a)gmail.com <mailto:passionforlanguage@gmail.com>>, Dennis Chan <firstjuly(a)gmail.com <mailto:firstjuly@gmail.com>>, donald and miriam <donaldshand18(a)gmail.com <mailto:donaldshand18@gmail.com>>, 'Gay Buckingham' <gaybuckingham(a)tuatara.net.nz <mailto:gaybuckingham@tuatara.net.nz>>, Jan Burch <jrb5050(a)gmail.com <mailto:jrb5050@gmail.com>>, Jessica Shields <jess.alice.shields(a)gmail.com <mailto:jess.alice.shields@gmail.com>>, Liz Mitchell <lizfrizzle1962(a)gmail.com <mailto:lizfrizzle1962@gmail.com>>, Maria Callau <maria(a)sur-architecture.com <mailto:maria@sur-architecture.com>>, marianne quinn <mariannequinn(a)xtra.co.nz <mailto:mariannequinn@xtra.co.nz>>, mikehazelnz(a)gmail.com <mailto:mikehazelnz@gmail.com>, Min <bluefrog(a)orcon.net.nz <mailto:bluefrog@orcon.net.nz>>, ""pauline" <PaulineTaylor" <pauline.anne.taylor(a)gmail.com <mailto:pauline.anne.taylor@gmail.com>>, rainer <rainer.ucol(a)gmail.com <mailto:rainer.ucol@gmail.com>>, 'Rosemarie Smith' <rose(a)voland.co.nz <mailto:rose@voland.co.nz>>, Sander Zwanenburg <sander.zwanenburg(a)otago.ac.nz <mailto:sander.zwanenburg@otago.ac.nz>>, Sandy Ross <sfross(a)xtra.co.nz <mailto:sfross@xtra.co.nz>>, sara ferreira <ferreirasara(a)yahoo.com <mailto:ferreirasara@yahoo.com>>, Susan Jack <susanjjack(a)gmail.com <mailto:susanjjack@gmail.com>>, Susan Taylor <taysue70(a)gmail.com <mailto:taysue70@gmail.com>>, 'Tim Ross' <tim(a)architype.co.nz <mailto:tim@architype.co.nz>>, warren hurley <warren.hurley(a)orcon.net.nz <mailto:warren.hurley@orcon.net.nz>> >>> Subject: FW: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol >>> >>> Am resending this as seems to have been misunderstood. More reading below: >>> >>> https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/unit-titles?gclid=Cj0KCQjwgJv4BRCrARIs… <https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/unit-titles?gclid=Cj0KCQjwgJv4BRCrARIs…> >>> https://www.unittitles.govt.nz/body-corporate-how-it-works/#:~:text=Every%2…. <https://www.unittitles.govt.nz/body-corporate-how-it-works/#:~:text=Every%2….> >>> >>> >>> If earthsong are managing with only one ‘committee’ either they aren’t unit titles or they are breaking the law. Have a feeling I have heard something to suggest it is the former. Regds roz >>> >>> >>> >>> From: Ucol-shareholders <ucol-shareholders-bounces(a)list.king.net.nz <mailto:ucol-shareholders-bounces@list.king.net.nz>> On Behalf Of Roz Wilson >>> Sent: Wednesday, 8 July 2020 8:54 am >>> To: 'UCOL shareholders' <ucol-shareholders(a)list.king.net.nz <mailto:ucol-shareholders@list.king.net.nz>> >>> Subject: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Have been reading up about body corporates and how ucol will be run. >>> >>> >>> >>> Definition of a body corporate: A Body Corporate is a legal entity made up of all the unit owners within a unit titled property. >>> >>> Definition of a committee: a person or group of persons elected or appointed to perform some service or function, as to investigate, report on, or act upon a particular matter. >>> >>> >>> >>> Seems we will have two governing bodies, neither of which are actually committees. >>> >>> >>> >>> The body corp looks after the rules, makes changes to them, polices them if necessary and does the management type tasks. Unless something comes up, maybe a request for a variation, the body corp meets only once a year. It is not a committee because membership is limited to people actually named as owners. >>> >>> >>> >>> An organising committee, which for us would not be a committee either as membership is looser and no one is actually elected, can include owners, owner’s children, tenants etc and looks after the day to day running of the whole property. Eg when to have working bees, what to do for Christmas and do we really need an ice cream machine. >>> >>> so can we please discuss membership of the body corp on the 26th as the bit at the bottom of min’s flowchart seems to be contrary to the laws about body corps. Thanks roz >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>

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Fwd: FW: running ucol
by Rainer Beneke 10 Jul '20

10 Jul '20

Hi all further to our discussion on Thursday, Roz’s emails and Gay’s suggestion to ask the legal team, I suggest to read following items regarding unit titles. There is the more plain english version on the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment website, see ‘Making decisions”: https://www.unittitles.govt.nz/body-corporate-how-it-works/ Or if you like the more wordy version go to the Unit Titles Act 2010, page 88 ‘Meetings and voting’: http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/2010/0022/31.0/whole.html I am aware that we always try to make clear that we are not a ‘commune', but rather a cohousing neighbourhood, and that the fundamental difference is that the finances are kept independent. The Unit title Act regulates this personal investment in a unit title housing complex. If we feel that the Unit Title Act is not clear, we could get legal advice as Gay has suggested, rather than keep arguing in circles. That however will cost money. We have to create a legally sound Body Corp document, as it will be deposited with the department of Lands and Survey. Failing to do so could result in a delay of our settlement. I also like to make it clear that I do like our decision making process for our day to day running of Totora. Our progress so far is proof to that. And I hope we are able to use it for all our decisions in the future. regards Rainer 'Please call me if you need an urgent reply. Rainer Beneke +64 21 144 7700 rainer.ucol(a)gmail.com > Begin forwarded message: > > From: <mariannequinn(a)xtra.co.nz> > Subject: RE: FW: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol > Date: 10 July 2020 at 1:46:44 PM NZST > To: "'bluefrog'" <bluefrog(a)orcon.net.nz>, "'Roz Wilson'" <michael.rosemary(a)xtra.co.nz>, "'alex king'" <alex(a)king.net.nz>, "'Anne Thomson'" <e.anne.thomson(a)gmail.com>, "'Catherine Spencer'" <cmspencer.nz(a)zoho.com>, "'Claire Loftus'" <passionforlanguage(a)gmail.com>, "'Dennis Chan'" <firstjuly(a)gmail.com>, "'donald and miriam'" <donaldshand18(a)gmail.com>, "'Gay Buckingham'" <gaybuckingham(a)tuatara.net.nz>, "'Jan Burch'" <jrb5050(a)gmail.com>, "'Jessica Shields'" <jess.alice.shields(a)gmail.com>, "'Liz Mitchell'" <lizfrizzle1962(a)gmail.com>, "'Maria Callau'" <maria(a)sur-architecture.com>, <mikehazelnz(a)gmail.com>, "'\"pauline\" <PaulineTaylor'" <pauline.anne.taylor(a)gmail.com>, "'rainer'" <rainer.ucol(a)gmail.com>, "'Rosemarie Smith'" <rose(a)voland.co.nz>, "'Sander Zwanenburg'" <sander.zwanenburg(a)otago.ac.nz>, "'Sandy Ross'" <sfross(a)xtra.co.nz>, "'sara ferreira'" <ferreirasara(a)yahoo.com>, "'Susan Jack'" <susanjjack(a)gmail.com>, "'Susan Taylor'" <taysue70(a)gmail.com>, "'Tim Ross'" <tim(a)architype.co.nz>, "'warren hurley'" <warren.hurley(a)orcon.net.nz> > > Hi Min – it seems I am going to be a bit of a broken record on this one point. In the last two meetings, in response to questions I have raised, it is clear that we have not agreed as a group that “ all body Corp decisions will be made on the basis of consensus” only. I am curious that this keeps being repeated as if in fact we had agreed this was the case. > > As I said last night, I appreciate some people feel strongly that all decisions should be based on consensus, while at the same time, several people feel equally strongly that options other than consensus need to be retained. > > I do appreciate all the work you've done on this! > > Regards > > Marianne > > Marianne Quinn > > Level 3, 115 Stuart Street, Dunedin > P.O. Box 20, Dunedin 9054 > ph +6434773115 or 0211612050 > > > > From: bluefrog <bluefrog(a)orcon.net.nz> > Sent: Friday, 10 July 2020 10:32 AM > To: Roz Wilson <michael.rosemary(a)xtra.co.nz>; alex king <alex(a)king.net.nz>; Anne Thomson <e.anne.thomson(a)gmail.com>; Catherine Spencer <cmspencer.nz(a)zoho.com>; Claire Loftus <passionforlanguage(a)gmail.com>; Dennis Chan <firstjuly(a)gmail.com>; donald and miriam <donaldshand18(a)gmail.com>; 'Gay Buckingham' <gaybuckingham(a)tuatara.net.nz>; Jan Burch <jrb5050(a)gmail.com>; Jessica Shields <jess.alice.shields(a)gmail.com>; Liz Mitchell <lizfrizzle1962(a)gmail.com>; Maria Callau <maria(a)sur-architecture.com>; marianne quinn <mariannequinn(a)xtra.co.nz>; mikehazelnz(a)gmail.com; "pauline" <PaulineTaylor <pauline.anne.taylor(a)gmail.com>; rainer <rainer.ucol(a)gmail.com>; 'Rosemarie Smith' <rose(a)voland.co.nz>; Sander Zwanenburg <sander.zwanenburg(a)otago.ac.nz>; Sandy Ross <sfross(a)xtra.co.nz>; sara ferreira <ferreirasara(a)yahoo.com>; Susan Jack <susanjjack(a)gmail.com>; Susan Taylor <taysue70(a)gmail.com>; 'Tim Ross' <tim(a)architype.co.nz>; warren hurley <warren.hurley(a)orcon.net.nz> > Subject: RE: FW: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol > > Hi Roz, I'll set aside some time to discuss this at the workshop. > However, while all owners legally have a right to participate in the Body Corp, I don't think there is a law that excludes the option of inviting non owners into the body Corp meetings, so long as the owners agree. > > It becomes a matter of how inclusive the co-housing community wants to be, as opposed to a standard, ordinary unit title development. In fact making decision by consensus only is already not the normal process for passing bc resolutions. > > We can also waive or change the need for a body Corp committee if the owners agree. We could end up with many small commitees like co-housing groups Jan saw in America, rather than one administrating committee that is the norm. > > Min > > -------- Original message -------- > From: Roz Wilson <michael.rosemary(a)xtra.co.nz <mailto:michael.rosemary@xtra.co.nz>> > Date: 10/07/2020 8:53 am (GMT+12:00) > To: alex king <alex(a)king.net.nz <mailto:alex@king.net.nz>>, Anne Thomson <e.anne.thomson(a)gmail.com <mailto:e.anne.thomson@gmail.com>>, Catherine Spencer <cmspencer.nz(a)zoho.com <mailto:cmspencer.nz@zoho.com>>, Claire Loftus <passionforlanguage(a)gmail.com <mailto:passionforlanguage@gmail.com>>, Dennis Chan <firstjuly(a)gmail.com <mailto:firstjuly@gmail.com>>, donald and miriam <donaldshand18(a)gmail.com <mailto:donaldshand18@gmail.com>>, 'Gay Buckingham' <gaybuckingham(a)tuatara.net.nz <mailto:gaybuckingham@tuatara.net.nz>>, Jan Burch <jrb5050(a)gmail.com <mailto:jrb5050@gmail.com>>, Jessica Shields <jess.alice.shields(a)gmail.com <mailto:jess.alice.shields@gmail.com>>, Liz Mitchell <lizfrizzle1962(a)gmail.com <mailto:lizfrizzle1962@gmail.com>>, Maria Callau <maria(a)sur-architecture.com <mailto:maria@sur-architecture.com>>, marianne quinn <mariannequinn(a)xtra.co.nz <mailto:mariannequinn@xtra.co.nz>>, mikehazelnz(a)gmail.com <mailto:mikehazelnz@gmail.com>, Min <bluefrog(a)orcon.net.nz <mailto:bluefrog@orcon.net.nz>>, ""pauline" <PaulineTaylor" <pauline.anne.taylor(a)gmail.com <mailto:pauline.anne.taylor@gmail.com>>, rainer <rainer.ucol(a)gmail.com <mailto:rainer.ucol@gmail.com>>, 'Rosemarie Smith' <rose(a)voland.co.nz <mailto:rose@voland.co.nz>>, Sander Zwanenburg <sander.zwanenburg(a)otago.ac.nz <mailto:sander.zwanenburg@otago.ac.nz>>, Sandy Ross <sfross(a)xtra.co.nz <mailto:sfross@xtra.co.nz>>, sara ferreira <ferreirasara(a)yahoo.com <mailto:ferreirasara@yahoo.com>>, Susan Jack <susanjjack(a)gmail.com <mailto:susanjjack@gmail.com>>, Susan Taylor <taysue70(a)gmail.com <mailto:taysue70@gmail.com>>, 'Tim Ross' <tim(a)architype.co.nz <mailto:tim@architype.co.nz>>, warren hurley <warren.hurley(a)orcon.net.nz <mailto:warren.hurley@orcon.net.nz>> > Subject: FW: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol > > Am resending this as seems to have been misunderstood. More reading below: > https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/unit-titles?gclid=Cj0KCQjwgJv4BRCrARIs… <https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/unit-titles?gclid=Cj0KCQjwgJv4BRCrARIs…> > https://www.unittitles.govt.nz/body-corporate-how-it-works/#:~:text=Every%2…. <https://www.unittitles.govt.nz/body-corporate-how-it-works/#:~:text=Every%2….> > > If earthsong are managing with only one ‘committee’ either they aren’t unit titles or they are breaking the law. Have a feeling I have heard something to suggest it is the former. Regds roz > > From: Ucol-shareholders <ucol-shareholders-bounces(a)list.king.net.nz <mailto:ucol-shareholders-bounces@list.king.net.nz>> On Behalf Of Roz Wilson > Sent: Wednesday, 8 July 2020 8:54 am > To: 'UCOL shareholders' <ucol-shareholders(a)list.king.net.nz <mailto:ucol-shareholders@list.king.net.nz>> > Subject: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol > > > Have been reading up about body corporates and how ucol will be run. > > Definition of a body corporate: A Body Corporate is a legal entity made up of all the unit owners within a unit titled property. > Definition of a committee: a person or group of persons elected or appointed to perform some service or function, as to investigate, report on, or act upon a particular matter. > > Seems we will have two governing bodies, neither of which are actually committees. > > The body corp looks after the rules, makes changes to them, polices them if necessary and does the management type tasks. Unless something comes up, maybe a request for a variation, the body corp meets only once a year. It is not a committee because membership is limited to people actually named as owners. > > An organising committee, which for us would not be a committee either as membership is looser and no one is actually elected, can include owners, owner’s children, tenants etc and looks after the day to day running of the whole property. Eg when to have working bees, what to do for Christmas and do we really need an ice cream machine. > so can we please discuss membership of the body corp on the 26th as the bit at the bottom of min’s flowchart seems to be contrary to the laws about body corps. Thanks roz

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Ucol-shareholders July 2020