Hi all
further to our discussion on Thursday, Roz’s emails and Gay’s suggestion to ask the legal team, I suggest to read following items regarding unit titles.
There is the more plain english version on the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment website, see ‘Making decisions”:
https://www.unittitles.govt.nz/body-corporate-how-it-works/
Or if you like the more wordy version go to the Unit Titles Act 2010, page 88 ‘Meetings and voting’:
http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/2010/0022/31.0/whole.html
I am aware that we always try to make clear that we are not a ‘commune', but rather a cohousing neighbourhood, and that the fundamental difference is that the finances are kept independent. The Unit title Act regulates this personal investment in a unit title housing complex.
If we feel that the Unit Title Act is not clear, we could get legal advice as Gay has suggested, rather than keep arguing in circles. That however will cost money.
We have to create a legally sound Body Corp document, as it will be deposited with the department of Lands and Survey. Failing to do so could result in a delay of our settlement.
I also like to make it clear that I do like our decision making process for our day to day running of Totora. Our progress so far is proof to that. And I hope we are able to use it for all our decisions in the future.
regards Rainer
'Please call me if you need an urgent reply. Rainer Beneke +64 21 144 7700
rainer.ucol@gmail.com
Begin forwarded message:
From: mariannequinn@xtra.co.nz Subject: RE: FW: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol Date: 10 July 2020 at 1:46:44 PM NZST To: "'bluefrog'" bluefrog@orcon.net.nz, "'Roz Wilson'" michael.rosemary@xtra.co.nz, "'alex king'" alex@king.net.nz, "'Anne Thomson'" e.anne.thomson@gmail.com, "'Catherine Spencer'" cmspencer.nz@zoho.com, "'Claire Loftus'" passionforlanguage@gmail.com, "'Dennis Chan'" firstjuly@gmail.com, "'donald and miriam'" donaldshand18@gmail.com, "'Gay Buckingham'" gaybuckingham@tuatara.net.nz, "'Jan Burch'" jrb5050@gmail.com, "'Jessica Shields'" jess.alice.shields@gmail.com, "'Liz Mitchell'" lizfrizzle1962@gmail.com, "'Maria Callau'" maria@sur-architecture.com, mikehazelnz@gmail.com, "'"pauline" <PaulineTaylor'" pauline.anne.taylor@gmail.com, "'rainer'" rainer.ucol@gmail.com, "'Rosemarie Smith'" rose@voland.co.nz, "'Sander Zwanenburg'" sander.zwanenburg@otago.ac.nz, "'Sandy Ross'" sfross@xtra.co.nz, "'sara ferreira'" ferreirasara@yahoo.com, "'Susan Jack'" susanjjack@gmail.com, "'Susan Taylor'" taysue70@gmail.com, "'Tim Ross'" tim@architype.co.nz, "'warren hurley'" warren.hurley@orcon.net.nz
Hi Min – it seems I am going to be a bit of a broken record on this one point. In the last two meetings, in response to questions I have raised, it is clear that we have not agreed as a group that “ all body Corp decisions will be made on the basis of consensus” only. I am curious that this keeps being repeated as if in fact we had agreed this was the case.
As I said last night, I appreciate some people feel strongly that all decisions should be based on consensus, while at the same time, several people feel equally strongly that options other than consensus need to be retained.
I do appreciate all the work you've done on this!
Regards
Marianne
Marianne Quinn
Level 3, 115 Stuart Street, Dunedin P.O. Box 20, Dunedin 9054 ph +6434773115 or 0211612050
From: bluefrog bluefrog@orcon.net.nz Sent: Friday, 10 July 2020 10:32 AM To: Roz Wilson michael.rosemary@xtra.co.nz; alex king alex@king.net.nz; Anne Thomson e.anne.thomson@gmail.com; Catherine Spencer cmspencer.nz@zoho.com; Claire Loftus passionforlanguage@gmail.com; Dennis Chan firstjuly@gmail.com; donald and miriam donaldshand18@gmail.com; 'Gay Buckingham' gaybuckingham@tuatara.net.nz; Jan Burch jrb5050@gmail.com; Jessica Shields jess.alice.shields@gmail.com; Liz Mitchell lizfrizzle1962@gmail.com; Maria Callau maria@sur-architecture.com; marianne quinn mariannequinn@xtra.co.nz; mikehazelnz@gmail.com; "pauline" <PaulineTaylor pauline.anne.taylor@gmail.com; rainer rainer.ucol@gmail.com; 'Rosemarie Smith' rose@voland.co.nz; Sander Zwanenburg sander.zwanenburg@otago.ac.nz; Sandy Ross sfross@xtra.co.nz; sara ferreira ferreirasara@yahoo.com; Susan Jack susanjjack@gmail.com; Susan Taylor taysue70@gmail.com; 'Tim Ross' tim@architype.co.nz; warren hurley warren.hurley@orcon.net.nz Subject: RE: FW: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol
Hi Roz, I'll set aside some time to discuss this at the workshop. However, while all owners legally have a right to participate in the Body Corp, I don't think there is a law that excludes the option of inviting non owners into the body Corp meetings, so long as the owners agree.
It becomes a matter of how inclusive the co-housing community wants to be, as opposed to a standard, ordinary unit title development. In fact making decision by consensus only is already not the normal process for passing bc resolutions.
We can also waive or change the need for a body Corp committee if the owners agree. We could end up with many small commitees like co-housing groups Jan saw in America, rather than one administrating committee that is the norm.
Min
-------- Original message -------- From: Roz Wilson <michael.rosemary@xtra.co.nz mailto:michael.rosemary@xtra.co.nz> Date: 10/07/2020 8:53 am (GMT+12:00) To: alex king <alex@king.net.nz mailto:alex@king.net.nz>, Anne Thomson <e.anne.thomson@gmail.com mailto:e.anne.thomson@gmail.com>, Catherine Spencer <cmspencer.nz@zoho.com mailto:cmspencer.nz@zoho.com>, Claire Loftus <passionforlanguage@gmail.com mailto:passionforlanguage@gmail.com>, Dennis Chan <firstjuly@gmail.com mailto:firstjuly@gmail.com>, donald and miriam <donaldshand18@gmail.com mailto:donaldshand18@gmail.com>, 'Gay Buckingham' <gaybuckingham@tuatara.net.nz mailto:gaybuckingham@tuatara.net.nz>, Jan Burch <jrb5050@gmail.com mailto:jrb5050@gmail.com>, Jessica Shields <jess.alice.shields@gmail.com mailto:jess.alice.shields@gmail.com>, Liz Mitchell <lizfrizzle1962@gmail.com mailto:lizfrizzle1962@gmail.com>, Maria Callau <maria@sur-architecture.com mailto:maria@sur-architecture.com>, marianne quinn <mariannequinn@xtra.co.nz mailto:mariannequinn@xtra.co.nz>, mikehazelnz@gmail.com mailto:mikehazelnz@gmail.com, Min <bluefrog@orcon.net.nz mailto:bluefrog@orcon.net.nz>, ""pauline" <PaulineTaylor" <pauline.anne.taylor@gmail.com mailto:pauline.anne.taylor@gmail.com>, rainer <rainer.ucol@gmail.com mailto:rainer.ucol@gmail.com>, 'Rosemarie Smith' <rose@voland.co.nz mailto:rose@voland.co.nz>, Sander Zwanenburg <sander.zwanenburg@otago.ac.nz mailto:sander.zwanenburg@otago.ac.nz>, Sandy Ross <sfross@xtra.co.nz mailto:sfross@xtra.co.nz>, sara ferreira <ferreirasara@yahoo.com mailto:ferreirasara@yahoo.com>, Susan Jack <susanjjack@gmail.com mailto:susanjjack@gmail.com>, Susan Taylor <taysue70@gmail.com mailto:taysue70@gmail.com>, 'Tim Ross' <tim@architype.co.nz mailto:tim@architype.co.nz>, warren hurley <warren.hurley@orcon.net.nz mailto:warren.hurley@orcon.net.nz> Subject: FW: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol
Am resending this as seems to have been misunderstood. More reading below: https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/unit-titles?gclid=Cj0KCQjwgJv4BRCrARIsA... https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/unit-titles?gclid=Cj0KCQjwgJv4BRCrARIsAB17JI7YRyAYQ9mPwWCnhxZRrbny-y3zzT9AhcPThfp6NIwCBQzW5JaoPSEaAhSUEALw_wcB https://www.unittitles.govt.nz/body-corporate-how-it-works/#:~:text=Every%20.... https://www.unittitles.govt.nz/body-corporate-how-it-works/#:~:text=Every%20unit%20title%20property%20has,issues%20and%20vote%20on%20decisions.
If earthsong are managing with only one ‘committee’ either they aren’t unit titles or they are breaking the law. Have a feeling I have heard something to suggest it is the former. Regds roz
From: Ucol-shareholders <ucol-shareholders-bounces@list.king.net.nz mailto:ucol-shareholders-bounces@list.king.net.nz> On Behalf Of Roz Wilson Sent: Wednesday, 8 July 2020 8:54 am To: 'UCOL shareholders' <ucol-shareholders@list.king.net.nz mailto:ucol-shareholders@list.king.net.nz> Subject: [Ucol-shareholders] FW: running ucol
Have been reading up about body corporates and how ucol will be run.
Definition of a body corporate: A Body Corporate is a legal entity made up of all the unit owners within a unit titled property. Definition of a committee: a person or group of persons elected or appointed to perform some service or function, as to investigate, report on, or act upon a particular matter.
Seems we will have two governing bodies, neither of which are actually committees.
The body corp looks after the rules, makes changes to them, polices them if necessary and does the management type tasks. Unless something comes up, maybe a request for a variation, the body corp meets only once a year. It is not a committee because membership is limited to people actually named as owners.
An organising committee, which for us would not be a committee either as membership is looser and no one is actually elected, can include owners, owner’s children, tenants etc and looks after the day to day running of the whole property. Eg when to have working bees, what to do for Christmas and do we really need an ice cream machine. so can we please discuss membership of the body corp on the 26th as the bit at the bottom of min’s flowchart seems to be contrary to the laws about body corps. Thanks roz